First, although I most assuredly would be on my face, I would truly welcome this. I appreciate this focus on messenger vs angel as it (to me) makes much more sense. The fact that these messengers are male is no surprise given God’s very specific about the ‘male’ role in mankind and as such, a ‘female’ messenger wouldn’t have credibility as she would be outside God’s defined role.
I’ve never been enamored with the focus on the (mythical) angels we see in society. I’m an artist and minored in art history in college. Angels are everywhere in all mediums of art throughout history, primarily during medieval times. Considering this in light of this article, concluding through research that the ‘dragon’ had been intimately involved with the Catholic faith from the very beginning; that much of the church tradition is pagan rituals included to bolster the spread of ‘religion’ and thus, generate more control and profit. Much of the totalitarianism we see today started with the church from the time of the persecution of the Cathars in France. Templars come to mind, too.
Today, the world’s believers in the Catholic faith have been duped through manipulation and sleight of hand into actually worshipping the evil one. Children are at the core of this evil. The ‘so-called ‘benevolent angels’ and what we’ve been programmed to see them as (cherubs and women primarily) in art is the opposite of how God describes the messengers.
What an enlightening article that has me (once again) revamping my perception of what God truly means when He teaches us the purpose of His messengers.
I think you probably know this already, but Zechariah (5:6-11) does call out two "women who carry Wickedness" in the ephah and set her up in the land of Shinar (Babylon); a vision of what I believe to be the system of systems described in Rev. 17 and 18 and judged by God in chapter 19.
It is a challenge to have to read and then replace with "messenger" every time the word "angel" is used, but I have found it worth the effort because of the added clarity it brings.
Thank you again for your comments! Blessings to you and yours!!
I find it interesting that many of the 'traditions' of the Catholic faith, as passed down by the 'apostolic succession' (i.e., a verbal process and therefore almost certainly resulting in an accumulation of error, and open to corruption by evil) fly directly in the face of the plain text of the Bible. The very 'apostolic succession' itself, as I understand it the concept that Christ gave his power to the Apostles shortly before He ascended, who then passed said power to the present-day bishops in the 'unbroken succession,' is contradicted by Matthew 28:16-20 -- which we know as the Great Commission -- in which Jesus clearly said 'I have been given all power...' and 'I will be with you always.'
If there were to be a time where Christ would give His power to someone, this would have been the time... but instead, He claims the power for Himself and says 'I am with you always, even unto the end of the world.' (Mt 28:20 KJV)
It is no wonder that the Catholic Church benefited from the widespread illiteracy of the people, allowing only the elite (churchmen) the privilege of owning a Bible, as they could basically tell the people whatever they wanted and nobody would be the wiser.
Of course all that ended when Gutenberg invented the printing press ca. 1455 and printed his Bible, at a cost that almost anyone could afford, and literacy for the first time began to become universal or nearly so. Then people could read for themselves what God and Christ had done and said. It amazes me that Catholics still accept these 'traditional' practices in the modern day, but they do, at least on the surface. I suppose this is why the Catholics do not use the Bible much but probably like the Anglicans and their 'Book of Common Prayer' rely on their traditional materials instead.
In fact and support of your final thought, it was in 1545 (a little less than a decade after Tyndale's martyrdom by the Roman Catholic Church) that they decreed their traditions equal to the scriptures - though it took another 225 years for them to declare their popes infallible when speaking "ex cathedra".
But lest it seem that I am pious as a "protestant", we evangelicals face the same temptation of exalting the words of men above those of God and of following the path first taken by those who (in Ex.20:18-21) chose to have an intermediary rather than to receive the words of God voice to voice. He has always desired a kingdom of priests and a nation of those set apart (Ex.19:3-6; Rev.5:9-10) - and our Lord has made that possible!! His Spirit has come to enable us all. He is so Gracious!!
Thank you WB for your insights and for taking the time to read and share!!
You're welcome and thank you for putting your thoughts 'out there' to stimulate us to think!
Temptation will be with us until the final victory, it is up to us to decide what path to take. Thanks be to God that we have this choice, the choice to accept Christ as our Lord and Savior. As with the old saw about leading the horse to water, not everyone will make the correct choice; but then, that is the inevitable consequence of free will.
I believe God, all Powerful, could force us to believe; but it means more to Him to have one mortal man accept His Grace and Salvation through Christ, of his own free will, than to force the whole world to follow Him. And that is how it must be, one believer at a time.
“ Today, the world’s believers in the Catholic faith have been duped through manipulation and sleight of hand into actually worshipping the evil one.”
I felt sad when I read your statement. I understand the negative emotion towards the hierarchy of the Catholic Church and I share that sentiment.
But I was raised Catholic and the core of the teachings I received as a kid and teenager were Jesus’ teaching of love and forgiveness. The last time I attended mass was some 5 decades ago and my favorite part was the pause to turn to the people near you, hold their hand and say, “May the Peace of God be with you” ❤️
I suspect your position about Catholics is rooted in the national exposure of pedophilia among priests and the coverup by the hierarchy. It was awful and thankfully exposed! Do you think it was only the Catholic priests? It is also something that occurs with “authority” figures in other Christian denominations also…as well as sports in our schools and just about anywhere that corrupted souls in positions of authority with children think they can get away with it.
I respect anyone’s love of the Old Testament with an intention of discerning truth…there are many paths of devotion to God.
“It is said there are ‘ten thousand ways to God,’ for each practice fulfills a purpose at a given time in each individual’s spiritual evolution”.
First, although I most assuredly would be on my face, I would truly welcome this. I appreciate this focus on messenger vs angel as it (to me) makes much more sense. The fact that these messengers are male is no surprise given God’s very specific about the ‘male’ role in mankind and as such, a ‘female’ messenger wouldn’t have credibility as she would be outside God’s defined role.
I’ve never been enamored with the focus on the (mythical) angels we see in society. I’m an artist and minored in art history in college. Angels are everywhere in all mediums of art throughout history, primarily during medieval times. Considering this in light of this article, concluding through research that the ‘dragon’ had been intimately involved with the Catholic faith from the very beginning; that much of the church tradition is pagan rituals included to bolster the spread of ‘religion’ and thus, generate more control and profit. Much of the totalitarianism we see today started with the church from the time of the persecution of the Cathars in France. Templars come to mind, too.
Today, the world’s believers in the Catholic faith have been duped through manipulation and sleight of hand into actually worshipping the evil one. Children are at the core of this evil. The ‘so-called ‘benevolent angels’ and what we’ve been programmed to see them as (cherubs and women primarily) in art is the opposite of how God describes the messengers.
What an enlightening article that has me (once again) revamping my perception of what God truly means when He teaches us the purpose of His messengers.
Thank you!! God bless.🙏🙏
I think you probably know this already, but Zechariah (5:6-11) does call out two "women who carry Wickedness" in the ephah and set her up in the land of Shinar (Babylon); a vision of what I believe to be the system of systems described in Rev. 17 and 18 and judged by God in chapter 19.
It is a challenge to have to read and then replace with "messenger" every time the word "angel" is used, but I have found it worth the effort because of the added clarity it brings.
Thank you again for your comments! Blessings to you and yours!!
I find it interesting that many of the 'traditions' of the Catholic faith, as passed down by the 'apostolic succession' (i.e., a verbal process and therefore almost certainly resulting in an accumulation of error, and open to corruption by evil) fly directly in the face of the plain text of the Bible. The very 'apostolic succession' itself, as I understand it the concept that Christ gave his power to the Apostles shortly before He ascended, who then passed said power to the present-day bishops in the 'unbroken succession,' is contradicted by Matthew 28:16-20 -- which we know as the Great Commission -- in which Jesus clearly said 'I have been given all power...' and 'I will be with you always.'
If there were to be a time where Christ would give His power to someone, this would have been the time... but instead, He claims the power for Himself and says 'I am with you always, even unto the end of the world.' (Mt 28:20 KJV)
It is no wonder that the Catholic Church benefited from the widespread illiteracy of the people, allowing only the elite (churchmen) the privilege of owning a Bible, as they could basically tell the people whatever they wanted and nobody would be the wiser.
Of course all that ended when Gutenberg invented the printing press ca. 1455 and printed his Bible, at a cost that almost anyone could afford, and literacy for the first time began to become universal or nearly so. Then people could read for themselves what God and Christ had done and said. It amazes me that Catholics still accept these 'traditional' practices in the modern day, but they do, at least on the surface. I suppose this is why the Catholics do not use the Bible much but probably like the Anglicans and their 'Book of Common Prayer' rely on their traditional materials instead.
Amen!
In fact and support of your final thought, it was in 1545 (a little less than a decade after Tyndale's martyrdom by the Roman Catholic Church) that they decreed their traditions equal to the scriptures - though it took another 225 years for them to declare their popes infallible when speaking "ex cathedra".
But lest it seem that I am pious as a "protestant", we evangelicals face the same temptation of exalting the words of men above those of God and of following the path first taken by those who (in Ex.20:18-21) chose to have an intermediary rather than to receive the words of God voice to voice. He has always desired a kingdom of priests and a nation of those set apart (Ex.19:3-6; Rev.5:9-10) - and our Lord has made that possible!! His Spirit has come to enable us all. He is so Gracious!!
Thank you WB for your insights and for taking the time to read and share!!
You're welcome and thank you for putting your thoughts 'out there' to stimulate us to think!
Temptation will be with us until the final victory, it is up to us to decide what path to take. Thanks be to God that we have this choice, the choice to accept Christ as our Lord and Savior. As with the old saw about leading the horse to water, not everyone will make the correct choice; but then, that is the inevitable consequence of free will.
I believe God, all Powerful, could force us to believe; but it means more to Him to have one mortal man accept His Grace and Salvation through Christ, of his own free will, than to force the whole world to follow Him. And that is how it must be, one believer at a time.
“ Today, the world’s believers in the Catholic faith have been duped through manipulation and sleight of hand into actually worshipping the evil one.”
I felt sad when I read your statement. I understand the negative emotion towards the hierarchy of the Catholic Church and I share that sentiment.
But I was raised Catholic and the core of the teachings I received as a kid and teenager were Jesus’ teaching of love and forgiveness. The last time I attended mass was some 5 decades ago and my favorite part was the pause to turn to the people near you, hold their hand and say, “May the Peace of God be with you” ❤️
I suspect your position about Catholics is rooted in the national exposure of pedophilia among priests and the coverup by the hierarchy. It was awful and thankfully exposed! Do you think it was only the Catholic priests? It is also something that occurs with “authority” figures in other Christian denominations also…as well as sports in our schools and just about anywhere that corrupted souls in positions of authority with children think they can get away with it.
I respect anyone’s love of the Old Testament with an intention of discerning truth…there are many paths of devotion to God.
“It is said there are ‘ten thousand ways to God,’ for each practice fulfills a purpose at a given time in each individual’s spiritual evolution”.
Peace, dear ALtab❤️🕊🕊